Healthcare Reform: Conspiracy Theory.

[Doville]

Not my intention to ignite controversy on a peaceful place like this one; just letting members know what I've been doing outside of the WB- whenever my school work allows...

Anyone interested may answer the questions that follow.

While some called "conservatives" are fighting ferociously against healthcare reform in the U.S., some of us are fighting as activists for its approval. Those on the far right- the same who furiously opposed the creation of Medicare when it was first presented -keep claiming that socializing any part of medicine is a communist measure. This time, we are going to win the fight. Even if it fails to be approved as unblemished as we wanted, it will be approved in some form and it will still be a victory. Any measure benefiting the majority should always win for our society to prosper.

We know that although most agree with the need for a reform at present, some don't want to credit Obama for its implementation. They are willing to sacrifice themselves and others for political or racist reasons. Some even claim there is a deeper motive, a sinister agenda behind the appearance of our present events.

We in the U.S. are always a mile behind every other civilized country in the world in our general thinking and actions, but we need everyone else's help whenever we need it. Our general state of healthcare as well as every other important issue is laughable in its absurdity.

Maybe there is still a secret Communist conspiracy for world domination (although it was already proven a failure with the demise of the Soviet Union); maybe now the Muslims are trying to take over our world through Obama (some can assure us he is a secret Muslim). Almost anything we can imagine might be possible, but I have a couple of questions for whoever wants to answer them:

1- Since maybe the whole civilized world is wrong and we are right, in which way are we so different than everyone else?

2- Do we in the U.S. need SOMETHING to be afraid of all the time?

[James Waters AKA. NineSpeed]

I have a question. Why is it when someone disagrees with something someone of color says, does or puts forth, the opposing person is considered a racist? why must race be brought into it all? You are white, I am white, I don't happen to agree with your stance. Am I still a racist? If you were green and I disagreed with you, Would I then be a racist?

Do I deny that there are people out there who appose Obama based solely on skin color? No. But for me at least I don't care what his race, creed or nationality is. These play no part in the reason I disagree with his policy on health care.

I disagree with his policy because I think the policy is wrong. I think it will put a financial burden on this country we will never be free of. I think it takes away peoples freedom of choice and their dignity. You are probably scratching your head on that last part. Let me explain.

People in this country have gotten so used to the government taking care of them, they have forgotten how to take care of themselves. All these social programs have done is create a nation of people who can not think for themselves, refuse to be responsible for themselves, and have no pride in themselves. When all you have to do is stick your hand out and wait for someone to fill it, what incentive do you have to better yourself? To strive to be more than you are. It seems to me that the Democratic party thinks we the people are too stupid to fend for ourselves. That the only way the people can prosper is if we create a social program to cover every aspect of their lives. I am sorry, I have my big boy pants on and am quite capable of taking care of myself. Thanks anyway.

I do think we are being led on a one way trip to a one world government. I for one do not want to be led in that direction. Most are either to blind to see it happening or have been brainwashed to the point of actually striving for it.

The problem with both sides of the isle is no one wants to hear an opposing idea, thought or concept. Both sides hate the other so much they are incapable of talking to one another. And who suffers for that? we the people. Why do you think there has been a massive movement of constituents of both parties to become independents? People are fed up.

They feel our government has become deaf to those they were put there to serve, and that the corruption and greed on both sides have become dangerous.

You say your side is going to win, and what if your side does? Who pays the price for that victory? Our children and grandchildren that's who. Of course there are those on both sides that are incapable of seeing or hearing beyond their own hate and hunger for power.

Afraid? you bet your boot straps I'm afraid, And I believe it is with good reason.

[Doville]

Do I deny that there are people out there who appose Obama based solely on skin color? No. But for me at least I don't care what his race, creed or nationality is.
Good for you! When I said "some", I meant some; no need to be paranoid.



I think it will put a financial burden on this country we will never be free of. I think it takes away peoples freedom of choice and their dignity.
It doesn't. People should be free to do as they wish, and their individual choice in healthcare is not taken away. Our important issues should be the ONLY thing we pay taxes for. The financial burden has already been placed by the Bush administration and our kids and grandkids are going to pay for it. By the way, you wouldn't want to take away socialized Medicare now, would you? That was proven a good measure!

I do think we are being led on a one way trip to a one world government. I for one do not want to be led in that direction.

You would have to put some facts on the table for that one; otherwise, you might be a conspiracy nut at best.

Cheers, Doville

[James Waters AKA. NineSpeed]

I will state now what I have stated before, I am against socialized anything. I am for people standing on their own two feet. The job of the government is to maintain the military, build roads and bridges, and keep our borders safe. It is not the Job of our government to be the surrogate mother of every citizen of the country.

If this wonderful health plan is so fantastic, the answer this country has been looking for since its conception, Why aren't the politicians jumping to sign up? No democrat has answered that question yet. They dodge the question every time it is asked. As I have stated before, the end game of this is to force the eventual total control of the health care system. One with out choice.

I'll tell you what I'll do, The day Obama signs up, Puts his family on it, I promise to be the first citizen in line with my family to sign up. If he is the great leader you tout him to be, then he should lead the country by example. Deal? And of course I will expect you to be the next in line.

[Rose Jansen]

Just curious, if Obama's health care reform plan is so bad, just what would you suggest that could be done that would be better? Or do you think that there is nothing wrong with the health care system that we have? How about saying some specific items that you disagree with Obama's plan.

James Waters AKA. NineSpeed said:

I will state now what I have stated before, I am against socialized anything. I am for people standing on their own two feet. The job of the government is to maintain the military, build roads and bridges, and keep our borders safe. It is not the Job of our government to be the surrogate mother of every citizen of the country.

If this wonderful health plan is so fantastic, the answer this country has been looking for since its conception, Why aren't the politicians jumping to sign up? No democrat has answered that question yet. They dodge the question every time it is asked. As I have stated before, the end game of this is to force the eventual total control of the health care system. One with out choice.

I'll tell you what I'll do, The day Obama signs up, Puts his family on it, I promise to be the first citizen in line with my family to sign up. If he is the great leader you tout him to be, then he should lead the country by example. Deal? And of course I will expect you to be the next in line.

[Doville]

The plan is going to be signed one way or the other. Like I said before, it has been proven all over the civilized world and it works, but this country is always behind on everything; which leads me to the fact that you're dodging the first question I asked.

Now, taxes for the military, for keeping away illegal immigrants? I don't think so! That's a huge investment that should be made in our important issues. You all talk a lot about your religious and moral issues, but poverty, healthcare and homelessness ARE moral issues; we shouldn't have those issues in this country.


James Waters AKA. NineSpeed said:

I will state now what I have stated before, I am against socialized anything. I am for people standing on their own two feet. The job of the government is to maintain the military, build roads and bridges, and keep our borders safe. It is not the Job of our government to be the surrogate mother of every citizen of the country.

If this wonderful health plan is so fantastic, the answer this country has been looking for since its conception, Why aren't the politicians jumping to sign up? No democrat has answered that question yet. They dodge the question every time it is asked. As I have stated before, the end game of this is to force the eventual total control of the health care system. One with out choice.

I'll tell you what I'll do, The day Obama signs up, Puts his family on it, I promise to be the first citizen in line with my family to sign up. If he is the great leader you tout him to be, then he should lead the country by example. Deal? And of course I will expect you to be the next in line.

[James Waters AKA. NineSpeed]

What would I do? I would firstly encourage banks to offer free HSA accounts that would accur interest once the accounts reach a predetermined level. I would also bring about the creation of health savings bonds that could be put toward catastrophic illness or surgeries. I would not tax business to death but would rather offer tax breaks to companies offering High quality insurance to their employees.

I would make it illeagle for insurance companies to deny coverage to anyone with pre existing conditions and dropping people from their plan for claims. I would also make that insurance portable and universal in the since that you can buy that insurance from any state. I would put funds aside to pay for health care for the indigent and homeless.

As for our military, These men and woman put their lives on the line to keep this country safe and I feel their insurance should be free. These funds would also be set aside as they are for the indigent and homeless.

I would work with pharmacutical companies to lower the cost of medications, and as a part of our free trade agreement with Canada and Mexico I would make it legal to buy pharmacuticals from these countries if they could be purchased at a lower cost.

I would work with the hospitals to help bring down costs by encouraging them to charge at fair market cost for medications and medical supplies. No more $40.00 asprins and $35.00 bandaids.

I would pass torte reform so that our doctors would not have to deal with frivilous law suits, bringing down their costs which in turn would bring down the cost to John Q. Public. I would also work with colleges offering Medical schooling to bring down the cost of tuition for that schooling and increase the amount offered in pell grants and the like to encourage more medical school students, and this would cover the areas of nursing, CNA, Med Aids and so forth. If it deals with medical it falls under this plan.

I would offer an Opt out option of social security allowing people to keep more of their paychecks with the understanding that they are responsible for themselves as far as their retirment and medical goes. I would take away the age limit on medicare and medicade and revamp those systems by locking those systems from the government taking any money out of that system to use elsewhere. I would call for an audit of those systems and deal with the fraud and miss management found there.

I would strengthen the laws governing and the requirements for recieving these benefits making it a felony to defraud them. I would also set limits a family can recieve for welfare and work to stop the abuse of that system by mothers haveing more and more children just to recieve more benifits. and require a time limit set for ending those benifits. Thus encouraging people to get off their butts and getting a job.

I don't mind people getting a hand up, but I am damned tired of people looking for a hand out.

[James Waters AKA. NineSpeed]

As to the question you Asked Doville, How are we different the rest of the free world? Heres how. Their economies are set up to cover universal health care. They are taxed to the gills and the government subsidises part of the cost. Their medical care is rationed and their citizens are placed on long waiting list for procedures.

Our econemy is not set up that way, except for the tax part. The major problem With the President's plan and the major contention that has everyone up in arms is simply this. It is to much to fast. The European and Asian economies were built with universal health care in place from the beginning. Ours wasn't. You can't drop a bombshell of that magnitude on our economy and expect no fallout. Especially considering the huge amount of money spent to prop up and bail out these other programs, A.I.G, The car companies, the banks. And especially considering the huge amount of pork laced throughout the bill. Remove all of the pork and focus on what is needed for medical only and you cut the cost virtually in half.

Everyone agrees our healcare system has flaws, mostly from fraud, mismanagement, and the sticky fingers of the government, not to mention the absolute greed of the insurrance companies. Fix those problems first. Spend more on research and development of life saving procedures and medicines. The over all care system it self is the best in the world, that is why people come here from all over the world for care.

[Doville]

James, for a person who claims independency from any party, your ideas are purely Republican. Where exactly are your independent ideas? I don't mind anyone's way of thinking and I respect Republicans as well as Democrats or Independents. The only question I see here is your opinion in our healthcare.

The World Health Organization is the ranking authority on health. Here's their evaluation:

http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html

U.S. is number 37, right behind Costa Rica. Even impoverished countries ranging from South and Central America, Africa and Asia rank much better. It seems like the countries with a more socialized healthcare are the ones with a better healthcare system.

Aren't you the person claiming that others can't see the truth when in front of their eyes?

I completely agree with the mismanagement, pork barrel, fraud etc, but that has become a part of Washington very difficult to resolve. Apart from this, our healthcare still in the toilet.

James Waters AKA. NineSpeed said:

As to the question you Asked Doville, How are we different the rest of the free world? Heres how. Their economies are set up to cover universal health care. They are taxed to the gills and the government subsidises part of the cost. Their medical care is rationed and their citizens are placed on long waiting list for procedures.

Our econemy is not set up that way, except for the tax part. The major problem With the President's plan and the major contention that has everyone up in arms is simply this. It is to much to fast. The European and Asian economies were built with universal health care in place from the beginning. Ours wasn't. You can't drop a bombshell of that magnitude on our economy and expect no fallout. Especially considering the huge amount of money spent to prop up and bail out these other programs, A.I.G, The car companies, the banks. And especially considering the huge amount of pork laced throughout the bill. Remove all of the pork and focus on what is needed for medical only and you cut the cost virtually in half.

Everyone agrees our healcare system has flaws, mostly from fraud, mismanagement, and the sticky fingers of the government, not to mention the absolute greed of the insurrance companies. Fix those problems first. Spend more on research and development of life saving procedures and medicines. The over all care system it self is the best in the world, that is why people come here from all over the world for care.

[James Waters AKA. NineSpeed]

Call it what you will right is right. I don't care which side it comes from. No one has proposed half of the ideas I have mentioned on either side of the board. Why is it wrong for people to take responsibility for their own needs? That's what I have been talking about all the long. Why is it the only way to help people is to give them a hand out? What does that teach to anyone?

You ask how my ideas are independent? Because I ask people to do something to help themselves. The democrats don't have a clue what that means? They have been spoon fed the government milk for so long they don't know any different.

As for the republicans, if your not a major contributor to the party, or a major corporation they don't have time for you. Both sides only know how to dig deeper into the working mans pockets.

As for our medical system, I invite you to go to Canada for medical treatment. Experience Socialized medicine for yourself, then come back here and tell us how wonderful it is. Or if you know someone from Canada simply talk to them. Get a first hand idea of what it is like from them.

And just so you know, regardless of what party you align yourself with, in the end it is about people. And it doesn't matter who the idea comes from so long as it serves the needs of everyone. Even if that idea comes from a republican or a democrat. That is what makes me an independent. Because I don't look at what party the idea comes from, I just look for the good idea. If it is good I call it good, If it sucks I say it sucks period. We only have two parties to work with so the choices are pretty limited.

[Doville]

Why is it wrong for people to take responsibility for their own needs?

Because they can't; people who are laid off, can't afford Health insurance, or can't afford the horrendous price of this healthcare, do get sick or have accidents. Some do get very sick.

We do know quite a few families who have gone for treatment not only to Canada but even to Peru and Mexico; all the modern technology and extremely cheap. But since I already presented you with the proof from the highest health authority, I rest my case.

Although this goes beyond our topic of healthcare...

With the Cyber Revolution and life as easy as clicks-of-the-finger away from all our needs, our generations want nothing but convenience. Administrations need to deliver entertainment as expected or they will be categorized as bad. What we got left at the end is the rancor towards the inefficiency of this or that administration to deliver as expected- we get this from both parties, even for the outcome of wars.


Democrats offer socialized this and that, help to the poor, more services and easier life for citizens; Republicans on the other hand, believe in hands-off government; they abandon citizens to their own destiny. And maybe build them some roads and bridges... not a lot of incentive with the exception of Christianity? But people purchase Christianity on their own, so... Oh, that's right, they offer wars. In fact wars are the only thing Republicans have to offer. Is it any wonder why our population is turning away from them?


Another fact to remember is that not all conservatives are republican but no republicans are liberal (they go as far as moderate conservatives); so all the odds are against the Republican Party in population favoring their measures.


It's an indisputable fact that Republicans can't win elections without the help of Democrats. They just don't have the percentage; they do in some districts but not for general elections.

My point is that your conservative ideas, applied to life-death situations like healthcare, are bound to die. You would remain like “Don Quixote” unable to change his mind because he was right...

Now I have to go party, it's Saturday night!

[Doville]

We have 556 members in TWB and we would like to have some different opinions on our current issue of healthcare reform. Although we're either aspiring or published writers, most of us live in the same country.

[Charlie Bear]

Personnally the way I see this comment is multi-leveled 1) "we"? are you more than one person? 2) you state that there are 556 memebers here, are you their spokesman? My point being speak for yourself and allow the rest of us to comment on the topic: if we feel like it. 3) I think your comment here is more based on the fact that you have reached an impass with James. However, wanna know something? He's right! And you don't like it.
Fine, I can live with that because everyone has the right to be wrong if they want; the only thing is you cannot expect everyone to join you in your error. Some of us are smarter than that.
So here's my questions: If socialized medicience is sooooo good, then why is it that a great deal of foreigners come to the US for medical treatment? If socialized med. is soooo great, why do people die waiting treatment?
Your President has run this country into the ground financially, and with the passage of a socialized health care system, will succeed in furthering that goal: is this really what you want; a "great health care system" backed by a government that is bankrupt? The cause would be higher health care costs than we currently "enjoy". Iin otherwords, if teh Gov. is bankrupt, they won't be able to inccurr the costs, so who else do they have to turn to? yes, kiddo, you and me!
I for one ain't gonna go there if I have anything to say about it.
Yes our current system is disfunctional, but a Government controlled system is NOT the answer, it won't fix a darn thing.
Oh, and in case you haven't figured it out, you have got the whole who cares for who thing backwards too: The only people that the Demo crits care about is their own.

The bottom line here kiddo really isn't a Demo vs Republician thing: it's more the true American's getting fed up with those in the Politico: because folks on both sides of the fence are screamin' mad at DC.

Two last comments: 1) do you know what DC really stands for (today)? Don't Care.............
2) I am not a Republican, or a Democrit, I am an American! I believe in God,and Personal Freedom.

Doville said:

We have 556 members in TWB and we would like to have some different opinions on our current issue of healthcare reform. Although we're either aspiring or published writers, most of us live in the same country.